Behind a Smile with Dr. Shauntel Ambrose
I host a podcast that shares the secrets behind some of the most resilient healthcare businesses worldwide, innovative products, savvy strategies and daily inspiration to reach your ultimate in your healthcare career. I interview the movers and shakers of healthcare who courageously push boundaries. Whether you a start-up, or needing a push to keep going or a family business or looking for mentorship without the business know-how. This is an all-inclusive, keeping it real, not for the faint-hearted, haters or the nay-sayers live your best life as a member of a global community in healthcare podcast!
Behind a Smile with Dr. Shauntel Ambrose
The Relentless Pursuit of Excellence with Dr. Kim Pedro-Beech
From the heart of South Africa's Western Cape, we bring you an intimate conversation with a trailblazer in maxillofacial surgery, Dr. Kim Pedro- Beech. Being one of the only women to have broken the gender barriers in this field in the region, her story promises to inspire and ignite. She takes us along on her journey from early aspirations of dentistry to becoming one of the pioneering women surgeons, overcoming significant obstacles along the way.
As we traverse this path, we delve into Dr. Pedro-Beech's passion for cleft surgery, providing an in-depth look at the challenges and rewards this specialty offers. Her experiences, both as a surgeon and a woman in a field dominated by men, offer a unique perspective on gender equality in the medical field. Dr. Pedro-Beech's belief in competence and qualification over gender is a testament to her commitment to excellence.
We also explore the lesser-known aspects of her life, balancing the roles of a mother and a high-powered professional, and the role of technology in South African healthcare. Furthermore, Dr. Pedro- Beech illuminates the importance of communication in marriage, an aspect often overlooked in the daily hustle. So tune in, and let Dr. Pedro-Beech's inspiring journey in maxillofacial and oral surgery motivate you to push your boundaries and reach for the stars.
Hi, I'm Chantal Ambrose. I'm a dentist and I host a healthcare business podcast that shares tips straight from the industry leaders. So, whether you are a startup or needing a push in the right direction, a family business or just looking for some mentorship, join us. Welcome to some of our pioneering episodes of Behind a Smile.
Speaker 1:Today I have Dr Kim Pedro Beach and I'm very excited to have you in. We met when we were talking at Women in Implantology and it was one of those fascinating and really empowering moments when I met you, because I never really realized that the percentage of women that are in maxillofacial surgery is that small and I realized immediately that there's something very special about you and I am absolutely excited to have you on. I want to share a little bit about what you have to offer. So you're working at Cape Gate Medi Clinic and you are the only female maxillofacial and oral surgeon in the Western Cape and you have a special interest in orthographic surgery, implantology, cleft surgery. You recently now returned from India and I see that you participated in a fellowship now for cleft surgery, and I just really want to introduce you as being one of the powerhouses of maxillofacial. So welcome, dr Kim Pedro Beach.
Speaker 2:Thank you, Shinta. Thank you for having me at Stelio. Honour for me to be on this platform with you. So yeah, thank you for the invitation.
Speaker 1:So listen, when I was listening to you and you and when we were speaking together, I remember you calling out a statistic of being within the 14% of female maxillofacial surgeons in SA. Now tell me a little bit about how did you get to be one of these women and what led you there to be one of these pioneers?
Speaker 2:When I was young I always knew, for as long as I can remember, I wanted to be a dentist. I didn't really know about maxillofacial surgery, so I've been wanting to do dentistry since primary school and that's kind of what I focused on and it worked out as planned. And even during my undergrad I liked oral surgery. But I was never really dead set on maxillofacial surgery. And you know, it is when you were undergrad student you want to get your quotas done and you want to get done and get out. But it wasn't in my community service here I was in Kimberley and we had a rotation where we had to spend some time with the maxillofacial at Kimberley Hospital at the time and I tell you, when I watched this manual work I was amazed because it was like artwork and I think that ignited the flame. And so we were a group of commservs there and I begged all my colleagues to say, listen, guys, you don't like maxillofacial, let me do all your rotations. You know just, I could spend more time and this fire, you know just flame this fire in me and I then opted to stay another year and a half or year and a bit in that department after my community service, knowing that it's a long journey, I wanted to make sure, you know, is it what I want to do and to get? Sometimes when you look at things from the outside it looks different and when you're inside you see a different perspective. So I opted to then stay another year and a bit in Kimberley, work in the maxillofacial department at Kimberley Hospital and I tell you the bug bit and I knew that's what I want to do. So, yeah, from there I then came back, just worked as a dentist initially in Cape Town, got into the oral surgery department. You know, you kind of didn't realize you need to get, you know, get involved in academics. So started lecturing, got involved with research, started doing more academic presentations in the department. And that's kind of how you. You need to upskill yourself as you go around this journey and you very soon realize that it's not a you don't rush this journey. It's not a rush. You got to allow the journey to mold you.
Speaker 2:And I say that because in my in 2014, 2015, I went for my first interview and you know, maxillofacial is very competitive and I had all my ducks in a row and I thought I had all my ducks in a row on paper I did. But just to give you perspective, we were, I think, 12 candidates, of which 11 was men and myself and just for five posts, and afterwards I didn't get in. And obviously hard on yourself and you're asking you know why. And looking back now I'm very thankful that I didn't get in there Because I wasn't ready. I might have had my ducks in the row on paper, but I didn't have the necessary clinical skill that I needed at the time and so I only then I got in for a developmental post about two and a half years and you could not say did I delay my life for two and a half years?
Speaker 2:No, I didn't, because when I finally got in in 2017, my baseline starting as a reg registrar was just so much better. So, yeah, it was. It was a long, tough journey and then I got in 2017, finished in 2022 at the University of the Western. Okay, and a tough five years of being a registrar. And, yeah, now my practice is just over a year old at Cape Gate Medi Clinic and I'm loving it. So long journey and but good, good, I'm happy, I'm happy Congratulations, Super congratulations.
Speaker 1:You know, often when you come to the end, people think that the beginning was quite simple and quite easy. So it's. It's always interesting to me when I listen to everyone's journeys and just the fight that it takes to keep on going with something you know that you want to do in life. I've heard quite a lot about now being a registrar. You've just finished being becoming a dentist, so you sort of have a sense of confidence about yourself. Now tell us a little bit about what do you expect as a registrar? What's that process like? What does your daily life look like and how is the? How does it differ from? Just from just your capacity? Now you've just come out, you've qualified as a dentist. Now you're in a developmental post to what sort of changes happen? What do you have to think about that you never knew even existed, in this change over now into going into specialization?
Speaker 2:It's actually a big, it's a steep learning curve because you've got a full time job and the hours are long. So you used I mean you're starting war drones at seven in the morning and you need to be prepared for those war drones and then you only finish in your day once the clinics and things are done. So that could be anything from five o'clock onwards and if you're on call you could be even called out at night and there's nothing. There's no post call where in certain disciplines if you're on call and you had a rough night to you home the next day you actually continue. And besides the workload, you've obviously got to prepare for what's to come. So if it's your theater time and your theater week, you've got to prepare for your cases. If you've learned on that day, you've got to go back and read up about what you've learned that day.
Speaker 2:Obviously, post grad is self study. You've got to study on your own and your consultants are there to guide you, you know, and rep you exam examinations, but it's a lot of self study. So it's a big sacrifice because you have to work life balance. That you would like to have, is not they during the rich time? So family time suffers. Social life suffers because you don't ever but a life. You live forward at that stage.
Speaker 1:I want to know what are the procedures you finding to be the most rewarding at the moment?
Speaker 2:Before I speak about specifics, for me what's rewarding in this is just a full circle. So, irrespective of what procedure you're doing, for me it's about being blessed to be able to treat someone and then, when your patient is satisfied at the end of the day, and you look at your work and you're proud of what you've done, that for me is more important than the actual procedure. But if I had to give specifics, obviously, as you mentioned earlier, I enjoy orthodontic surgery, something that we get exposed to, and I post-grad quite a bit and, yeah, I just love that. You pre-op, you were set in the way and post-op you've got that instant result and you're making a significant difference in your patient's life. So I really enjoy that. I enjoy traumatology too, let me say. Unfortunately, I have quite a lot of trauma in South Africa because of our interpersonal violence etc. So we get a lot of exposure to traumatology as a registrar, so I enjoy that too.
Speaker 2:I've always had a love cliff. We don't. In our post-graduate situation in the University of Western Cape, our exposure is not that much as what I would have loved to be for cliff surgery. I do feel because of the team in terms of dentist, orthodontist, maxillofacial plastic surgeon, prostodontist, and your allied workers. There's such a big team that can make such a difference in these cliff patients that I feel I want to be part of such a team because there's so much that I can contribute when I went to India now just seeing again the long journey you walk with these cliff patients from when they are babies primary work, to secondary work, when they are in their pre-teens, in their twins, to orthognathics in their late teens. So there's so much to do for them and I can't wait to be part of such a journey. And now, with private practice gives a little bit of a different exposure for maxillofacials and we do a bit more ortho surgery but you do quite a bit of implantology. I'm getting a new love for implantology too.
Speaker 1:Yes, well, it sounds as though you're one of those women that I think almost you mentioned almost everything that you do do, which means to me that you're really doing your love job. So I want to know, now that you've done a little bit of cleft, there are many of us that you remain unaware of just how involved cleft is, from the beginning to the end. So how many ops does that take now for one single cleft baby to?
Speaker 2:be fixed. So depends on what your initial diagnosis is. Is it just an isolated lip? Is there a lip and palate? You know, and also a lot of centres have different protocols in place, but if I can just maybe give a broader idea, you get a surgery, as a primary surgery would be in your earlier years. So anything from four, five months to 18 months. In that phase you can do your primary repair. Then you get something called alveolar bone grafting which you can do at a later age, like nine, ten.
Speaker 2:Okay, I'm just giving you little groups that these. Obviously there is cases that needs more. And then you also have orthodontics in your in your teens. Some of them need ortho genetics if it's indicated. Some of them need influence if it's indicated at a later age. So this quite a bit. You obviously get scarring vision. That can be done. You know these cases that perhaps if they've had palatal surgery and now they've got pharyngeal insufficiency, that needs to be addressed. So it's quite complex journey and not one is the same. So you almost need to treat them you know as individuals as what is needed per case.
Speaker 1:What's a long journey? Yeah well, thank you for sharing that, because I think it's often a journey that people don't pay too much of attention to, and I think that we just need more people who are able to solve those problems for our clipped children. So it's just, my background impedes I deal with a lot with some special needs and you see how it's a zone that just isn't the most go to place for most practitioners, because, in addition to being quite specific and each person is different it is something that requires a lot more time and a passion, and a lot of people would prefer to actually put that into a commercial boat of where they would like their focus to be rather than it. So I really appreciate that. So I want to know what are the most challenging parts of this job. This is a hard core job.
Speaker 2:I think time is one of the challenges, not so much in private, I must add. I think the harder part is your registrar time and if you're in government sector, because your calls are much worse, the work life balance suffers a bit more when you're in government sector. But yeah, time I think is a big challenge. I think for any specialty really is that the buck stops with you. So when my colleagues in the area refers to me they are sending to me to leave the buck stop with me and so that responsibility. It can sometimes be challenging but it's important, even as a specialist, to know when is your limit and when it's okay not to know everything that you also didn't ask, senior colleague. I mean that's across the board.
Speaker 1:So I think those would be challenging aspects of you know, I was just going to ask you that, actually, because I know that the programs are such that you do gain a level of mentorship now, when you're, when you're starting to go into registration, and I want to know now who are your mentors, who are the people that are your go-tos, and when the days are challenging and sometimes when you're just seeking inspiration or you're just needing a go-to fix, who are those people around you?
Speaker 2:It's quite a few to mention. Again, it's such a long journey that you almost don't want to leave out people along this journey. I mean I've got to start with a guy who's ignited my flame. I mean that would be Walid Saleh. He's still in Kimberly in private practice there, but I mean he's the one that was my first mentor and helped me get my ducks in the road to know how to start this journey. So I've got to give him credit for that. And then, during my registrar time, of course, dr Gregory Hine and Prof Sean Morkle. They've molded me into the surgeon I am, so they played a pivotal role, an important role, in my growth and my journey.
Speaker 2:And then these two other professors that I feel I need to mention in my journey, even though I spent not as much time with him, but it was the time was significant. And that's Prof Johan Reiner, who was actually my neighbour. I still chat to him quite a bit. He's just down the road in private practice. So yeah, and then what's nice while in private, sometimes private practice can feel a bit lonely because you kind of must that team dynamic At times. But my fellow colleague at the same hospital, you know, often pick up the phone and call him Mark. I can speak to Mark my ear quite often, and then I've got a few friends in the industry that I can chat to. You know, and that's what's nice about it is that you doing this love job together.
Speaker 1:If I could say that, you know, that's fantastic because I think that as we go through dentistry and in the current place that we in, you'll find that mentorship is becoming more available, where there used to be a time where mentorship just was available to only a few academics that would get into specialization and a few other people who were just well networked. And so it's nice to know, and it's reassuring to know, that there is this growing network and almost a change perspective in attitudes and behaviors that can support the community at large. I'm all for it. I do want to ask you what is quite a funny question to me is how now, in this very male dominated industry, how do you maneuver this male dominated industry and what are your in theater experiences like and what does gender equality look like now in the sphere of the industry?
Speaker 2:I do think gender equality in this specific field is quite multifaceted and allow me to look at it from different perspectives. Okay, just to give you a bit more insight, because often we focus on the men and that's not. It shouldn't just be there. But if I may start with like a tongue in cheek comment, just to give you a bit of an idea, I recall in my first week of being a registrar and I was in the clinics with one of the seasonal consultants and he was trying to teach me something and he makes a comment saying now you need to stop being a girl and start being a surgeon. Now, at the time I didn't have the courage to say anything back. I let it be. But in my mind I recall the feeling, thinking why is it either a girl or either a surgeon? And I told myself from that day I will prove that I can be both and be proud of being both. The thing moments like that is quite few and far between. In my journey it's been few and far between. But when you look at this gender equality, let's look at it from society perspective. If you in the clinics and you walk into a cubicle with a patient there and there's been many episodes. I've walked in with a male dental student. You know I had no clue of what's happening, but the patient would immediately focus onto that male and thinking he's the doctor and that's a societal problem. And so that's also where this gender equality is flawed, unfortunately, even in today's. Another aspect, obviously from a clinical or theater perspective, I must say I've been let me call it blessed in this fact that even in my role as developmental post, as a junior registrar or even as a senior registrar, I've only had men around me and they've never made me feel inferior. From my clinical perspective, I've never felt that from anyone, from my peers, you know, and I think you do grow a thick skin, so you probably don't allow it either. But I think of all these facets, for me the most important part that will change gender equality is us as females and how we perceive ourselves, because often we think we are less or we think we are inferior or we feel intimidated, and even though the males didn't intend to intimidate us, we automatically look at it that way, and that's something, a narrative, that we need to change.
Speaker 2:And let me give you an example of that. We were in a war ground and often we've got dental students that come for co-assistants and they come and participate in the war ground. So now obviously we're standing around a bed, it's all these guys and myself, and the prof is now asking questions and we're done with the war. And as we're walking back to the clinics, one of the younger ladies that's also aspiring to do maxillofacial surgery. She comes to me and she says how do I do it? You know, how do you not feel intimidated by the guy? And I said why should I be? What did they do to make me feel intimidated? We all stood around the same bed, we all got asked the same questions. They said nothing towards me.
Speaker 2:It's my mindset that should change and for me it was alarming that in this time we as women perceive ourselves that way. So I think often these, this equality, can be changed if we change the narrative and we have confidence and we equip our health and we've got. It's important and I wanna emphasize this when we go for interviews across the board, not just medical officials as women we shouldn't ride on the woman wave. We shouldn't wanna get the job because we're the only women in the interview and we're sitting with all other men. We should get the job because we are competent and we are qualified and we are women. It's got nothing to do with it. And so if we change that narrative, I think we'll get the respect we deserve.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's a very powerful perspective. So I do think that the narrative has to change and I think in society we are seeing the change. It's a very sad thing to me that there is still such a lot of discrimination on across the board on different levels of being able to do the career, because the career often should be based on just the skill set, rather than what we look like or who we are or where we come from or any of those things. Yeah, it's a very powerful paradigm shift that we are in right now, so I appreciate that.
Speaker 1:Listen, you know that my background has a lot of ethics related advice and I often get people ask me about referrals and we'll be very honest with you that, as a general practitioner, we give the referral hoping, without doubt, that the maxillofacial is gonna just save us from whatever it was that did not go right in that surgery and you're hoping never to see it again. And for the most part, what has happened with this, I find over the years, is that people don't stay in communication and the referrals become almost fluffy. Where it's, you're basing the referral on really trying to get somebody out of your office and make it somebody else's problem, but there's no learning that comes from it, where two professionals are working together to get something sorted out, and often that ends up, unfortunately, in a litigation process. So I want to know, as a maxillofacial, as a person that's so experienced and skilled, as a pioneer in the industry, what do you want to receive as a referrillator? What does that?
Speaker 2:look like ideally. Yeah. So I must tell you I like what you're saying in terms of sometimes the referrals are fluffy, and I understand that the time is obviously also a thing, because we often have somebody patients booked and you've got to get done and, like you say, you want to get the patient out but you also don't want to get to trouble or offend the patient or make the patient feel like you want to get rid of them. So I agree, I understand the dynamic, but communication is key and if it is something that can work, I do appreciate a detailed email. If it's something urgent, I even make time for an urgent phone call. So if I had cases where my referral base perhaps called my rooms and then my secretary would say, do you have a moment to just help? And if I can't at that moment, I call back. I am always at call, having that conversation and helping where I can, because to me it's about upscaling, because if you face that same thing tomorrow, you know how to deal with in a better way and I also where I can.
Speaker 2:On my referral form, I tried to keep it quite simple. There's different aspects where you can tick a box to what are you sending for ie auto surgery, ie implantology, orthognathics. Whatever the case, maybe you tick on there and you also have a tick to say would you like to get feedback? And how do you want that feedback? Because sometimes, yes, you run over your third model of distractions you might not want feedback, but if it's something specific and you're interested and you want to convert with me, I'm very happy to do so. Whether it be a report back via email or whether it be, let's chat about it. And for me that's important because it's not just, it's about upscaling one another and giving a better service to our patients.
Speaker 1:Okay. I think that if we can all, as you know, just as an industry at large think about each other in that way, we all can be uplifted. So I really I do agree with that. I want to ask you a question that often comes up in just group discussion and I ask almost every specialist we have on so we go into theater Do you have any sort of routines of how you go about choosing your anesthetist and how you communicate to your anesthetist so that collaboration can happen in theater, because I'm imagining a large part of your day is in theater. Can you give us a few tips of how to get that going and to sustain also what we're talking about, this almost a network of education from the people you're choosing to participate as team management?
Speaker 2:So my dynamic is slightly different because I've got fixed theatre time and fixed theatre lists. You almost if some people are doing your list here for you. How did I get to choose them? They often approach you. So once you go to private practice, you get group practices, a group anaesthetist that's either allied to your hospital or in the area and you sit down and have a chat first to just see if you connect from a personality perspective. So because I've got so much theatre time, I wanted to stay in a group practice because if someone's on leave there's someone to back up and that makes it easier from an admin perspective to have things arranged.
Speaker 2:But it's nice to also realise that you need to get on, you need to understand one another. You need to have that comfort level to be able to speak openly, because if you've got cases where you are uncertain of certain things or you have a question, you should feel comfortable and ask your need to just listen. What do you think of this? And if I have such a case few days before, even after consultation, I'll say listen, I'm booking this patient on that day. You are doing the list with me. This is my thoughts, what do you think? And we discuss it so that we prepared theatre day, and that's important. You need to find someone that, like I say, you get along with, you, can communicate openly with yeah, once you've got that, it works well.
Speaker 1:No, we talk a lot about a lot of trends that I'm carrying on at the moment for dentistry, so I've read a lot about this whole aspect of patients demanding weight loss treatment plans from this wiring of their jurors and things like that. I thought I just would love to hear your expert view.
Speaker 2:I must tell you I'm thankful I've never got that request, as I do, because it's definitely a no-no in my book. But I wonder if, for someone's weight loss journey, I would have chosen a different profession. I'm obviously. It's about patient health when you're on this weight loss journey. There's no quick fixes. So if someone is looking for a quick fix like IMF or jaw wiring, it's certainly a no-no in every level because as soon as you release that wires they'll just fall back into their old ways and you'll just pick up whatever you've lost and besides that your oral health is going to suffer in that period of time. And weight loss is not just about what you're putting in your mouth. It's a journey mentally, emotionally and so on every level. No, no, no, no, no. Wiring for weight loss, that's not the way to go, it's not the answer. I wouldn't even entertain that.
Speaker 1:I think that it's a sobering perspective, these quick fixes, and you become really aware that there's a desperation to do something very quickly. And I find that we see that a lot in from a general perspective. We see it a lot in moms that seek theater as a quick fix to getting rid of habits and not great habits, I must admit, and behaviors because the long term is harder than just the immediate fix. So I think that it is a red bell all the way around. So you've been traveling a lot and can you give us an idea now of what is MaxVec or abroad like, and what are your ideas about whether South Africa is keeping up with the industry standards? And where does MaxVec fit in in South Africa as compared to other countries that you've now been able to visit?
Speaker 2:I think challenge that MaxVec faces worldwide is that we not standardized in the sense of what's your requirement to become a MaxVec official surgeon, because some areas you can just be singly qualified as just a dentist or you need to be dual qualified dentistry and medicine and then only do MaxVec surgery. So that on its own poses quite a challenge in the worldwide perspective, because in other countries, for example, if you're only singly qualified you're going to do a shortened course and will be an oral surgeon. Yet when we're sitting in Congress together we're coming from different backgrounds, different qualifications, doing different things. So that in itself is a challenge and I wish that one day MaxVec official surgery in the worldwide context could come to a conclusion and say let's create this path so we all kind of on equal playing field. But I think that's an ideal world Coming from, especially now spending time in India, obviously very similar type of circumstances, poverty and patient profiles very similar. But I must tell you again, I can only speak on the South African context. I can speak from a University of Western Cape context because that's where I've, because even within South Africa itself we've got four institutions that change MaxVec official surgeons and all of us have differences too. We've all got our strengths and we've got our differences and, like my professor say, it's always important to be a good generalist, and once you're a good generalist from a start, you can then focus on something specific if you have a desire to do so.
Speaker 2:What's concerning me a bit? Let me first speak about a positive. A positive in South African context is we've got a lot of exposure to trauma, to pathology, cervical facial sepsis. We shouldn't sell ourselves short, because what we do here and what we see here is amazing and the mentors we have teaching us these things are really good and I do think that we are up with world standards in that regard. Something like trauma. I think the first world can come here and come and learn, because the volumes we see is quite a lot. So from that perspective it's a big positive for us and I think that what we're producing in South Africa is great work.
Speaker 2:What I am concerned about is when we're shifting from government to private practice. Our scope of practice becomes a bit narrower because you don't see the volumes of pathology, you don't see the volumes of trauma and you end up seeing a bit more from an auto-surgery perspective and in pathology tonight and you're getting a lot of overlapping. If I example, with cleft surgery, in the Western Cape, it's mostly run by plastic surgeons. In the Pretoria setting, it's mostly run by maxillofacial surgeons. So, again, depending on where you are, ent has a lot of overlapping with maxillofacial surgery and from a dental perspective, us and periodontists have a lot of overlapping. So I feel, from our future as maxillofacial surgeons, we, as the new generation, we should focus on not narrowing our field of expertise. We need to keep on growing. Keep on, you know, be a generalist and then each of us should focus on something so we can keep on growing, keep on inspiring, for sure.
Speaker 1:Are there any new tech savvy sort of ways to do? Do you expect that you've seen abroad that we haven't really touched base with here? What's our technological and digital footprint looking like in SA in terms of surgery?
Speaker 2:So we also up there with the first world countries, for sure. I think in terms of patient specific implants, in terms of scopes, in terms of the problem here is obviously always fine. So, yes, even now in our training you get some exposure to it. I mean, you can get patient specific implants in terms of joint replacements. You're getting patient specific implants in reconstruction. There's a lot that's being taught. Our limitation is on funding, unfortunately. So we are up there with the first world. We just don't have the resources to follow through. Another example we I'm hoping that our hospital can get a scope. I've had colleagues in the area that's gone for abroad for training to do scopes of the joint. It's not something that's perhaps taught as a post grad but again, because that's something niche, it's available here. We just need to then go abroad to get the training. But it's certainly definitely up there with the first world.
Speaker 1:Well, that's really reassuring. I appreciate that. Now I want to talk about the fact that you're a mum and you have this very, how high-powered job, and you're doing this amazing work amongst some of our, I think, most amazing male counterparts as well, and how do you keep all of this balance going? Now, what are these? Can you give anybody some advice on how do you get it all going for you?
Speaker 2:Well, balance is important and a good support system. I don't think if I didn't have such a wonderful husband supporting me and cheering me on, could be challenging without, without that. And obviously I've got. You know the old saying of a village that raises your child. I've got a village behind me and that makes the world of different.
Speaker 2:But I'm also, I must tell you, I make a point of Trying to maintain a balance. So I love my work, I love what I'm doing, but it's not my life. So when I'm at work I do my best, I love it, but when I go home I also love it. I love being a mom and I need to also show my goal how to be. You know if I could, if I may use the word, superwoman, and you know to kind of the cheek and also see that you know donate society, limit what you can do. So even as a wife, I think it's important that we need to focus on that role. But I Can knowledge that you also need that support of husband, and that's always easy to find. That unfortunately often Get women that's in a successful situation that might not find Apartment, that accepts that.
Speaker 2:I am just blessed that I do have that and which helps makes my balance so much easier. I must add another balance that I have is I love the outdoors and I love Mountain biking. So you also need to do me time to kind of keep it together and to realize that Me time is so valuable so that you can have mental health when you're doing your other roles. So I do a lot of at least once a week I go out and do some cycling and when you come back from that cycling you feel on top of the world. You need to tackle the next challenge. So, yeah, balance is important.
Speaker 1:I think that we've had so many amazing people on and we're speaking about mental health particularly from the idea of women doing more.
Speaker 1:And Remember, we come from a background where these are only new ideas and we we're still growing with getting women in the bigger roles Only because we had just these five basic roles at one stage and nothing more was needed and nothing more was expected and nothing more was given as an opportunity. And then, as that grew, we find that now we do have women that suffer burnout and we do have women that have mental health sort of challenges, because now our roles are still. We haven't given away the roles of being great mothers, we haven't given the way the roles of being great wives or of being alive in your faith or, you know, giving some time to yourself. We don't sort of move it over. We it's almost like we're working at the 200 and 300 and 400 percent rather than just 100 percent. And so what that has often happened if you don't sort of take a little bit of perspective and step back is that it has reached that point of Burner. You know, not always sunshine and roses.
Speaker 2:So I also want to emphasize that it's also okay not to be okay, but that you need to almost listen to yourself. So if, like you say, we're trying to fulfill all these roles and we're doing our best, she can't do your best all the time. So listen to yourself and if, at times, you do feel I am perhaps a little bit burnt out, burnt out, I am perhaps a little bit burnt out, take a step back, scale down on something and then, once you've, you know, recuperated a bit, you tackle it again. But it's okay not to be okay all the time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it's just a recognition that you're not okay, that that is the struggle at the moment. So I want to know what is your go-to stress reliever?
Speaker 2:on a daily basis. Yeah if I could cycle every day, I would. By the time I would probably do cycling as a stress reliever, because it's amazing for me. Certainly, pray, I'm Christian and I I love to be, you know, focused on my relationship with Christ. So for me, that you know, whatever your faith base is, whether it is meditation, whether it is prayer, whether it is just time for reading your holy scripture for me that's important to tap into that. So that would be my daily thing.
Speaker 1:What's the music playing on your on your playlist at the moment. What do you sometimes in theater? You ask the sisters you know, don't you have that on the playlist? I?
Speaker 2:must. I'm a bit of a boring soul. I do talk radio.
Speaker 1:What are you most proud of?
Speaker 2:I'm most proud of that. Whatever I've dreamt of, thus far I've achieved. I've set out a goal and even if I didn't succeed first time round, I kept going, kept my goal in mind and I've worked Very hard. To get here wasn't an easy journey handed to me, so I'm very proud of that. That I I can say I'm a maxillofacial surgeon because I've put in the hard work and to me it's important that I think I've mentioned it earlier it's not a rush, because often I find undergrad when they, once they finish, they want to okay, how do I, what do I do to get it? And I want to tick these boxes and I want to get in and I want to get done, and that's not it. So I'm going to make you great. You need to allow this journey to mold you and so for me, when I look back and I look forward, I'm looking forward to see how my journey is going to mold me. So that's what what prides me.
Speaker 2:I'm also proud mom. I love being a girl mom and I look forward to how I can inspire my girls. She's still very small, just only three and a half, but I look forward to see how I'm going to develop as a mom and how am I going to develop my girl to be her full potential? Yeah, and I'm also a proud wife, I think earlier you asked me also what I do daily to kind of just keep it together, and for me, communication is key in marriage. So when I get home I give my husband the year how was your day? And vice versa, because often we can, in the hustle and bustle of of daily life, we miss and live past each other so quickly. It's important that whoever your person is, that you become, you know, present in their presence, you reflect and you talk and you listen.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, thank you for that. I think that you've ended on a amazing and inspiring note. Congratulations on your journey. Just keep on doing what you're doing. I think that for every surgery that you do and for every person that you see, that there is a level of inspiration about you that is beyond just what you do and who you are, and we really appreciate it. So thank you very much, thank you, Chantal.
Speaker 2:Thank you for the opportunity.
Speaker 1:I've cut it starting up and had to turn your vision into a business, and in our future episodes we look at leadership, we look at multi-practice success and I'm grateful for you and I would love to hear your ideas. What questions do you need answered? Please drop me a mail at behindasmile2atchilealcom. I look forward to hearing from you and remember you are heard, you are seen and on this platform, you are invited. Let's make it happen together.